Installation from CD, then upgrade to v1.05 NO_CD Patch. Have I done everything in the right way?

[swagger]

Dear all,
I'm writing this post just to understand if I've done everything correctly.

I have resumed in the last days a CD version of RRT3 bought soon after its release (it's version 1.01).
I installed it on my new laptop bought just few months ago.
With the original Disc 2 inserted in the laptop (yes, even if new, the laptop still has the optical drive!!) it worked perfectly fine (version 1.01 shown on bottom side of the main screen).

Then I upgraded directly to v1.05 NO_CD patch without installing Coast-to-Coast (I don't want it for the moment) nor v1.05 patch.
However the game worked fine and the shown version in the bottom left corner of the main screen was "1.05". It was actually the real v1.05, since for example the "Disable Hardware T&L option" was available between the graphics settings, while it was not available in version v1.01.

Only after that I read that the NO_CD patch needs to be installed AFTER the v1.05 patch.
But does it really make any difference? Both are just RT3.exe files that replace each other. What is the difference between replacing RT3.exe ("v1.05 NO_CD patch") on top of the original RT3.exe (v1.01), instead of replacing it on top of RT3.exe ("v1.05 patch")?

After that I tried to run the game with the original RT3.exe file (v1.01) and the CD inserted and, when launched, it still says it's running v1.05, even if the "Disable Hardware T&L option" is not available between the graphics settings and other updates included with patches between 1.02 and 1.05 do not appear. This means that it is basically the v1.01 which is run, even if 1.05 is shown. Where is the version number coming from then, if not from the RT3.exe file?

Anyway, going back to RT3.exe ("v1.05 NO_CD patch") made everything working correctly, even if I'm still wondering if these continuous back and forth (I've made several test with different versions of the patches) could have created some mess into the game's files.

As a side note, I didn't need to disable Hardware T&L nor to apply DgVoodoo2 patch. The game is running on the Intel HD graphics chip (even if I have a dedicated NVidia Graphic Card) and it's not giving any problem with it.

Thank you in advance :)

[Gumboots]

Only after that I read that the NO_CD patch needs to be installed AFTER the v1.05 patch.
But does it really make any difference? Both are just RT3.exe files that replace each other. What is the difference between replacing RT3.exe ("v1.05 NO_CD patch") on top of the original RT3.exe (v1.01), instead of replacing it on top of RT3.exe ("v1.05 patch")?

Good point. I suppose everyone has always done it the long way just for belt and braces, and because for some software it is necessary to patch consecutively. Your logic makes sense though, and if it's working that's pretty good proof of concept.

Where is the version number coming from then, if not from the RT3.exe file?

Offhand I don't know, but somebody will (it's not something I've ever felt the need to check).

Anyway, going back to RT3.exe ("v1.05 NO_CD patch") made everything working correctly, even if I'm still wondering if these continuous back and forth (I've made several test with different versions of the patches) could have created some mess into the game's files.

If it's running without bugs I wouldn't worry. You can always extract any suspect files from a clean installation and replace them, if it's a concern.

As a side note, I didn't need to disable Hardware T&L nor to apply DgVoodoo2 patch. The game is running on the Intel HD graphics chip (even if I have a dedicated NVidia Graphic Card) and it's not giving any problem with it.

Good. Are you getting the "blurry textures thing"? That's when everything else works, but you get the C or D skin at close range. Or is it giving you the A skins like it should?

[RulerofRails]

Did you rename one or more exe files? For some reason the game seems to pull the version data from one called simply "RT3.exe" even if you ran one located in the same folder but with a different name. But in my experience for other intents and purposes you are running the one you clicked on. It's quite a puzzle why the game does that. But it's not serious from what I can tell.

I don't imagine you will see issues by skipping patches that just update the exe file. But I never experimented with it myself. I think the main reason patch 1.03 is here is because that was at one time the best workaround for the Hardware Tranformation & Lighting issue. And 1.04 because of Coast to Coast.

Interesting idea not to install Coast to Coast. The digital versions (Steam, GoG) come with Coast to Coast bundled in. What is your rationale behind that?

Yeah, I heard another report that the game is running sometimes without disabling Hardware Transformation & Lighting on Windows 10. That's good. If it aint broke don't fix it.

[swagger]

Thanks guys for the replies and sorry for my delay!

Good. Are you getting the "blurry textures thing"? That's when everything else works, but you get the C or D skin at close range. Or is it giving you the A skins like it should?

I don't know what the A, C or D skin you're talking about are, but I have the "blurry texture" problem even with the integrated Intel HD graphics, unless I put in the same folder the d3d8.dll patch.

Did you rename one or more exe files? For some reason the game seems to pull the version data from one called simply "RT3.exe" even if you ran one located in the same folder but with a different name. But in my experience for other intents and purposes you are running the one you clicked on. It's quite a puzzle why the game does that. But it's not serious from what I can tell.

Thank you very much, this could be the explanation. I have the 3 .exe files in the same folder, one called RT3_orig.exe, one RT3_v1.05.exe and the one with NO_CD patch simply called RT3.exe.
That could be the problem then. If I want to try version 1.01, I click on RT3_orig.exe, but probably it takes the version number from the RT3.exe file in the same folder (which is v1.05 NO_CD patch).

Interesting idea not to install Coast to Coast. The digital versions (Steam, GoG) come with Coast to Coast bundled in. What is your rationale behind that?

Because the version of RRT3 I have is originally in Italian language, while Coast to Coast expansion is not (I only found it in English). I would like to avoid creating problems in the game if it finds files from different languages. Or do you think it doesn't create any issue?

[Gumboots]

Thanks guys for the replies and sorry for my delay!

Good. Are you getting the "blurry textures thing"? That's when everything else works, but you get the C or D skin at close range. Or is it giving you the A skins like it should?

I don't know what the A, C or D skin you're talking about are, but I have the "blurry texture" problem even with the integrated Intel HD graphics, unless I put in the same folder the d3d8.dll patch.

The A skin is the top level image ("texture") for the locomotive and other assets graphics. Usually 1024x1024 in the case of locos, although some are only 512x512. If everything is working the way it should you will get this displaying at close range. If it isn't, you will get the D skin.

A good test is the default H10 Mikado. The A skin wheels for that are made from a 42x42 square of pixels, and look pretty round at close range. If you are getting the textures problem you'll see the wheels as a fat cross cut out of a 4x4 block of pixels. IOW, you'll see one central pixel with four others arranged around it. It's pretty obvious if you know what to look for.

I found the dgVoodoo patch was the best solution. I tried the earlier "blurry graphics fix", which I think is the patch you are referring to, but IMO the results aren't as good as Voodoo. Voodoo gives much better shading.

Because the version of RRT3 I have is originally in Italian language, while Coast to Coast expansion is not (I only found it in English). I would like to avoid creating problems in the game if it finds files from different languages. Or do you think it doesn't create any issue?

I don't think it will cause any problems. You can easily test it with a second installation (just copy the RT3 folder to another directory). There might be some text strings displaying as English instead of Italian. If there are missing strings one of us can easily give you a CtC language file. They're easy to edit if you feel like throwing in your own translations, or if you don't mind playing with the game set to English you could just use the CtC file as is.

[RulerofRails]

I did some digging. Coast to Coast doesn't include any localization. It will also therefore not overwrite existing localization. It's a handful of new maps and engines. That's it. The original maps have localization, the Coast to Coast maps do not. As with anything, the entire RT3 folder can be copied as a backup. Then when you experiment with the copy, nothing will be lost.

The version display issue is a bug. One potential workaround would be to launch the game via shortcuts (potentially on the desktop), and then use a different icon to denote which version you are running. Oilcan provided some basic examples here: viewtopic.php?f=5&t=2282&hilit=icon

[swagger]

A good test is the default H10 Mikado. The A skin wheels for that are made from a 42x42 square of pixels, and look pretty round at close range. If you are getting the textures problem you'll see the wheels as a fat cross cut out of a 4x4 block of pixels. IOW, you'll see one central pixel with four others arranged around it. It's pretty obvious if you know what to look for.

I found the dgVoodoo patch was the best solution. I tried the earlier "blurry graphics fix", which I think is the patch you are referring to, but IMO the results aren't as good as Voodoo. Voodoo gives much better shading.

Thanks for the explanation. Yes, I'm using the "blurry graphics fix" and it works fine for me, or at least for me it is enough.
I didn't compare it with the DgVoodoo results because even like this it's fine for me. It is a game more than 15 years old, even with the best graphic it could achieve it would anyway look "ugly" with respect to modern videogames. And the graphic is not the more important part of this game, in my opinion

I don't think it will cause any problems. You can easily test it with a second installation (just copy the RT3 folder to another directory). There might be some text strings displaying as English instead of Italian.

At the end I reinstalled everything from scratch, this time including also Coast to Coast expansion. You're right, it doesn't cause any problem apparently, and only the additional scenarios have labels in English. It is not a big problem anyway, I can deal with it without too many problems.
The reason I reinstalled everything was because I wanted to get rid of a problem I found in the resolution settings, where each resolution in the drop down menu is doubled. I thought it was a problem caused by the mess created during my first caothic installation, but it is still present with this clean one.

The version display issue is a bug. One potential workaround would be to launch the game via shortcuts (potentially on the desktop), and then use a different icon to denote which version you are running. Oilcan provided some basic examples here: viewtopic.php?f=5&t=2282&hilit=icon

Thanks for the hint. For the moment I solved the problem by reinstalling everything from scratch and only keeping the v1.05 no patch executable file. I will use this solution if I will try different versions in the future

[Gumboots]

If the English maps are bothering you it's probably not that hard to translate them. Not something I've ever done myself, but I know other people have translated third party maps before.

Re the graphics: true about the comparison with more modern games, but personally I like having water reflections, and better shaders anyway.